How Will They Be Remembered?

Hopefully Smith will get another chance with a coach who will know how to best utilitze him

Hopefully Smith will get another chance with a coach who will know how to best utilitze him

So Alex Smith has been placed on injured reserve, ending his season and what will most likely be his career as a San Francisco 49er. I shudder to think of what might have been for this kid had he been placed in a situation that was even somewhat manageable, ala Aaron Rodgers, Phillip Rivers or even Jay Cutler.

Some are going to look back and say that McNolan made the wrong choice in 2005 taking Smith over Rodgers and those people would be dreadfully incorrect in their assessment. It’s not about the player taken with the #1 overall pick in that draft, it never was.

It’s about the head coach. It’s about the revolving door at offensive coordinator that was allowed to be in place without a single agonizing thought about what it might be doing to the franchise player’s career.

It’s about the four different offensive systems that Smith had to learn in four seasons even after his college coach, Urban Meyer made the statement that, “he’s not a guy that you throw the ball out there and tell him, ‘Go play.’ He wants to know what is exactly expected of him and then he becomes a dynamite player.”

Smith sadly, was never given that chance. He was never extended the opportunity and time to learn what was expected of him in the four systems he was forced to learn on the fly.

Looking back at the debacle that has been the Mike Nolan regime in San Francisco it is truly clear that the situation could have and should have been drastically different. It wasn’t however and this is the legacy that Nolan will leave when he is unceremoniously fired either before the season ends or the moment it does.

“Rollin’ with Nolan” once meant that the team, its coaches and fans were standing behind the man who was tasked with righting the ship that was so wronged by the befuddled Terry Donahue and Dennis Erickson.

There were high hopes as Nolan said all the right things, made all the right moves (or so it appeared) and basically pulled the wool over everyone’s eyes. Most notably John York’s. In fact Nolan continued to do so at the end of last season when he, after two days of meetings emerged from the owner’s office to announce that he was retaining his position as head coach of the team. Albeit with reduced responsibility, York at least seeing that the power monger needed to be reeled in just a tad, a move for which he should be commended .

However deciding to hold on to Nolan for one more season was miscalculation in its own right.

The more important aspect of the cataclysmic events which have pushed this franchise ever farther to the deepest depths it has ever seen is that changes need to be made. In fact they need to be made sooner rather then later.

If it is a given (and it almost certainly is) that Nolan will be fired at some point in 2008 then it should be done with haste and with nary a glance in the rearview mirror. There is talent on this team, more so then many pundits would care to admit. It can have a winning season, but only if the move is made to get the appropriate man to lead it into battle.

It’s one thing for the fans of a team to lose their patience and belief in what the head coach is trying to accomplish, it’s another thing entirely when team insiders and players share the same sentiment. At this point I’m not sure if anyone has a clue as to what Nolan is hoping for other then making an effort to save his job which makes him not a man with the team’s best interest at heart but instead one who is hell-bent on his own desires.

If Mike Nolan had a heart and actually cared about the team and its fans then he would simply step aside and allow someone who knows what they’re doing to take over. Someone like Mike Martz for example, a man who is familiar with what it takes to win in this league.

There were two sequences in last weeks game where it was speculated that Nolan overruled Martz on his offensive play calls. The first came at the end of the second quarter when, facing a fourth-and-one the 49ers lined up to attempt the conversion. With the play-clock hitting zero it appeared that J.T. O’Sullivan would be called for a delay of game however the officials ruled that a timeout had been called beforehand.

In typical Mike Nolan fashion, playing not to lose instead of to win, the field goal unit came out and Joe Nedney converted the kick for three points. The second occurrence took place with the team facing a third-and-seven towards the end of the game. DeShaun Foster ran up the middle for six, the drive ended with another Nedney field goal.

The latter play is the more glaring of the two in that on a third down play like this Martz would have undoubtedly called a pass play, which he most likely did only to be overruled by Nolan. This might have something to do with the fact that Martz who almost always makes himself available for post-game questions disappeared from the locker room without speaking to anyone.

If in fact Nolan did pull rank on Martz and disallow him to make the calls in either of those situations that alone (at least in my mind) is reason enough to out an end to his tenure in the city by the bay. Martz is a renowned offensive mind and should be given full autonomy to call the plays as he see’s fit.

Nolan even iterated that this would be the case when training camp opened saying, “Mike [Martz], as I’ve said many times, has a great command of the offense. He’s had a lot of success as a head coach and as an offensive coordinator, and I respect that.”

If this is to be believed then Nolan has to relinquish control of that side of the ball to Martz and allow him to make the decisions at which he is so adept. Nolan should concentrate on defense, which is supposed to be his strength, although some would dispute even that.

If Nolan is intent on keeping his job past this season then he needs to learn when to keep his ego in check. Vetoing Martz’s play-calling on the opening week of the season was nothing more then him thinking that he knew better then someone who has been studying and immersing himself in offense since he came into this league.

Nolan’s actions need to be nipped in the bud immediately and someone near to the team needs to tell him so, which is highly unlikely being that no one else wants to lose their job either.




  • shane

    I didnt read the hole thing but i agree that if we would of gone with aaron rogers the same thing would have happened, and smith would be in greenbay right now living the dream

  • joe gomez

    I can agree with the Head Coach/Off. coordinator/WR excuse to a point James. The bottom line is Alex just isnt very good. We can make a thousand excuses for him, but it all comes down to him getting paid millions of dollars to perform and do his job. It all comes down to him as a professional QB in the NFL who must be capable of playing at the highest level. He showed some signs in the one Seattle game but other than that he never showed much. He had a 3 year run no matter how you look at it. In the NFL, people get cut after just one year of stinking it up. Alex had 3 years, and thats alot of commitment with negative results. So yes, Nolan is to blame, the different OC's to blame. The biggest mistake was drafting this guy #1 overall, he should of never went that high but we were desperate in getting a QB. Some people are just not cut out to be starting QB's in the NFL and hes just one of the many.

  • joe gomez

    Shane, I disagree.. Rodgers was better fitted for a pro-style offense and I think he would of adjusted a little better than Smith. Smith never looked comfortable being under center and I think that was a main problem with his timing. He never caught on as far as throwing before a receiver breaks and also never caught on as far as checking down to your 2nd, 3rd, 4th option. This is what is so good about JTO, he throws before the break and goes to his options even with pressure right in his face which he showed against the Cardinals. He did it more than a few times. His only negative is that hes prone to cough the ball up when pressured in the pocket. If that gets fit, you have the QB of the future. Because everything else about him is clicking good.

  • James Jones

    Meant for that to say "They" and not "He".

    I believe it has more then a chance of winning Rob, I simply feel that if it is going to happen Nolan either needs to hand the offense to Martz exclusively or step down altogether.

    I will say this, Martz will not put up with Nolan overpowering him with play calling. He will resign before he deals with that for to long.

  • joe gomez

    Wow..yeah Anderson wouldve been nice. Heard Campbell is doing good things in Washington. Its so hard to evaluate these guys coming to college. I mean look at Vince Young right now, WTF is going on with that guy right? BTW what did Nolan do to overrule Martz? I missed that one.

  • James Jones

    I never said you should care one way or the other; I was merely making a comment based on what I have viewed in your dealings with others on this site.

    Shortsightedness: Lacking foresight. http://www.thefreedictionary.com/shortsightedness

    As in some of your comments lack it.

    Nice job on noticing sarcasm in regards to the Nolan having a heart or not. Of course I think he wants to win, otherwise he loses his job.

    Wow, you don't think that McCloughan had a large hand in helping to bring in all of the players that have been drafted or signed as free agents? Go back and do some research of your own Adam and you will find that you are wrong and in fact it was McCloughan who was the most integral in selecting Smith over Rodgers for starters.

    Also I am well aware of what his title was before being named General Manager at the end of last season. The whole reason he was brought in from Seattle in the first place was to work with Nolan in finding and bringing in talent… ya know since his title with Holmgren was Director of College Scouting.

    Do you even remember what you read or does it just leak out as quickly as your brain fluid?

    What I said was "In typical Mike Nolan fashion, playing not to lose instead of to win, the field goal unit came out and Joe Nedney converted the kick for three points."

    The typical part was that Nolan coaches not to lose instead of to win… ask anyone in the know and they will concur.

    You're hilarious, you really think that if Martz had called the play as a pass and was subsequently overruled by Nolan that he'd be all over the teams beat reporters making it known? I'm sure that would be the best way to make things good in the teams coaches meetings.

    If supporting Nolan shown you anything I would think that it might be that what coaches say is not always the truth.

    I also loved Martz's comment about the play being an "unusual call" I suppose you could take that to mean whatever you want it to though.

    This article was about speculation Adam, as in it was possible that Martz was upset with the outcome of the game and being overruled on those two plays. Go back and read it once more so that you can see, I never accused Nolan of doing so, I only SPECULATED that he could have. We'll never know for certain what happened.

    It's laughable that my work is being called elementary by someone who posts in the manner that you do. And as for not being my best work, I'll take that as a compliment coming from you Adam.

  • Adam49

    Anything I can do to help just let me know.An unusuall call means he usually would have called a differant play.Lookup those 2 words.He said he thought they would be in man coverage.Lets speculate about the Seahawks.I'm sure that will be more High School than Elementary.And i'm glad you looked the word Shortsightedness up and found out it was 1 word.

  • Adam49

    Check out what Martz said about Gore…

    “I don’t worry about anybody other than Frank on how many touches they get,” said Martz. “Frank has to touch the ball. He is one of the very, very elite (guys) in the league, so we know we have to feature him and find ways to get him the ball. Isaac and Vernon, all of the other guys, B.J., are all good players, and they’ll have their opportunities, but the only guy you go into a game saying you know what this guy needs to touch the ball X amount of times is Frank.

    May hurt Vernon Davis's ego but it's the truth.Now I wanna see him do it.

  • AM

    i agree with you on the draw play. that was a stupid call. the field goal was not however. down by ten you have to get points on the board and if you go for it, there is a high chance that you don't make it. And i believe that they were just trying to draw the cardinals offsides, not actually go for it. and once again, whoever called the draw play is an idiot. that should be a 2nd and 7 play not a 3rd and 7 play.

  • James Jones

    Joe: Being an avid Cal Bears fan as well, it’s my opinion that even if Rodgers had been taken over Smith that the team would be in the same boat at this very moment. Perhaps not on the injury front but at least in regards to production. Rodgers first of all was a Tedford coached QB in college, not one of them has turned out to be anything close to worth his salt. Trent Dilfer (yes he won a ring but that was more about the Ravens defense then anything else), Akili Smith, Joey Harrington and Kyle Boller have not been very good and the latter three have have been absolute busts in my opinion.

    Rodgers, and to be honest the jury is still out on him after only one start, albeit a good one, is where he is now because he was able to sit behind one of the best quarterbacks in the history and has had good coaching to boot. Not to mention that Green Bay is vastly superior to anything the 49ers have fielded in the last four seasons. Smith on the other hand has been coached by the offensive football equivalent of Howdy Doody.

    I’m sorry but while I will agree that players have to play no matter what, Smith was set for failure from the start. Nolan is the most to blame for this and I will stand by that statement. Quarterbacks are a rare breed and some of them need to be taken care of with good coaching and leadership, Smith had neither in his time here. Couple that with the change in offensive systems and you would be hard pressed to find any QB in the league who could have survived in this scenerio.

  • Rob

    So, is the title referring to Smith or Nolan?

    Overall, I agree with your assessment of Nolan. I still believe this team has a chance of winning this year. But, I have believed that for the past few years and have yet to see positive results. The fact is, this team has talent. And, it’s high time it sees it’s full potential. Let’s get a real coach in here and finally see the playoffs again.

    I’m Rollin’ With Firing Nolan!

  • Adam49

    What I dont like about this article or any other article putting Smith and Nolan down is that we are all geniuses now that it’s said and done.Hinesight is 20/20 there’s no doubt about it.1st,we tried to trade the 1st pick and there was no buyers.2nd,if we would have picked someone else you and the rest of these bloggers would have chewed Nolan a new asshole about how we had a chance to take a franchise QB and we took X.Next,we have a damn good team here and it was put together mostly by Nolan.None of us on this site are NFL coaches and there’s a reason for that.It’s because we are good at talking crap about what the coaches have already done if it don’t work out.Bottom line is that I don’t agree with everything that Nolan and Co. has done but I look at the players they have brought in here and the players they had to deal with when they got here and there is no comparison.And if you want another important thing that Nolan has done,just look at our cap health.Nolan has taken us out of cap HELL and set us up in great condition for the future.He is our coach and he has done good things here.So i suggest that we start realizing everything that he has done not just the bad things.We are in good shape.So I disagree with most of your article.

  • http://49ersnews.com James

    Adam: Where in my article did I ever put Nolan down for selecting Smith? In fact I said itterated that it was the right selection looking back on it being that no Qb would have survived in this situation.

    But truth be told at the time I was all over the boards calling for neither Rodgers or Smith to be taken and instead thought the team should select Edwards and taken a QB later in the draft.

    Put together mostly by Nolan… you don’t think that Scot McCloughan had a large hand in the selection of all the players taken in the drafts and signed via free agency?

    Also Nolan did nothing to take this team out of cap hell, that was ALL Parage Marathe my friend. Nolan was not the one in there with all of these players negotiating contracts, although it wouldn’t have surprised me if he was, as power hungry as he was when he first arrived here.

    I’m not sure you are able to comprehend what this article was saying which is fine, being that it wouldn’t be the first time, as you have displayed the ability to rub some here the wrong way with your misunderstandings and short sightedness.

    Good for you and your ability to look past Nolan’s mistakes in the front office and on the field. One more thing in regards to this…

    “He is our coach and he has done good things here.So i suggest that we start realizing everything that he has done not just the bad things.We are in good shape.So I disagree with most of your article.”

    You can disagree all you want however the facts remain the same… what has be done with all of this “self-assembled” talent?

  • MSouza

    I'm just curious, what happens if we end up making the playoffs this year? Do we all still hate Nolan, do we give him any credit at all, or do we just chalk it up to luck and still fire him?

    Don't get me wrong I wouldn't be appalled if Nolan gets fired at the end of the year if we put up another disappointing year, but I don't see a quick fix on the coaching horizon. The only way our offense stays the same is if we promote Martz to the head coaching job, which in my opinion is a mistake. I think the best case scenario would be we coax Cowher out of retirement, but again, not necessarily going to solve all our problems, and he may enjoy working only a couple hours a week.

    I'm a bit leery of yet another coaching change, not because it might not be necessary, but because of who we may replace him with. I'm satisfied with anybody not named Dennis Erickson to be honest.

  • joe gomez

    I think James was mostly criticizing the way he coached Alex Smith which I agree he had SOME responsibility on his production but I dont blame the coach for how he turned out. I blame Alex Smith for the way he turned out. Nolan has some foolish play calling sometimes but I have to admit, he knows how to put together a defense. In any sport, when something goes bad, I look at the player first then the coach. Theres so much a coach can do from the sideline, its up to the player to execute, perform, and do his job on the field. Nolan shouldnt be blamed for Alex Smith’s demise because im sure McCloughan had something to do with picking him #1 overall also. Im sure Nolan didnt make the pick alone. He makes some bonehead play calling decisions especially on fourth down which drives me nuts but hes our coach so i have to support him.

  • joe gomez

    James.. who were some of the QB’s taken in the later rounds that year? Just curious.

  • http://49ersnews.com James

    Joe: Thanks for clarifying a little there. I blame both men for how Smith turned out. Circumstances being what they are he never had a chance. I do believe that if he and Rodgers had switched places it’d be Smith who would be excelling in Green Bay right now. Rodgers wouldn’t have known whether to scratch his watch or wind his a** if he had been on this team since 2005.

    I don’t support a coach who should have been fired before this season began and who (if the signs are correct) overruled a much smarter offensive mind on the field last week.

    Again this is merely my opinion Joe… good discussion.

    By the way here are the other QB’s taken after Smith and Rodgers.

    Jason Campbell – #25
    Charlie Frye – #67
    Andrew Walter – #69
    David Greene #85
    Kyle Orton – #106
    Stefan LeFors – #121
    Dan Orlovsky – #145
    Adrian McPherson – #152
    DEREK ANDERSON – #213
    James Kilian -#229
    Matt Cassel – #230
    Ryan Fitzpatrick – #250

    I only put Anderson in caps because of how he has turned out in Cleveland. There of course was no way to know this at the time of the 2005 draft (wouldn’t want to appear to be calling myself a genius in hindsight) however who knows where McCloughan and Nolan go with the other picks that year if we took Edwards at #1. Maybe the team takes Anderson and he is the savior. We’ll never know of course, I was only speculating.

  • joe gomez

    oops meant from college.

  • joe gomez

    Man to be picked #213, thats just proof right there you dont need to be the top pick to make it as a starting QB. Talent can be found way deep in the later rounds (ala Brady). I just hope JTO works out, I think he might end up surprising alot of us. An ex-NFL starting QB was on the radio (forgot who it was) saying that he was surprised that JTO has bounced around so much. He said he followed him in college and saw how quick he read the defensive schemes and was impressed with his quick release. Anyway, im not a betting man but they have the 9ers as 7.5 point underdogs. Thats a slap to the face if you ask me, so im putting some money down for the Niners to whoop that ass!

  • James Jones

    Very true statement Joe, you don’t need to a highly touted draft pick to be a good quarterback in this league, heck even Joe Montana was a third round pick.

    The Nolan-Martz issue was also speculation but from the way it appeared and the play calling history of the two men it sure appeared that Nolan overruled Martz on two occasions.

    From this article:
    “There were two sequences in last weeks game where it was speculated that Nolan overruled Martz on his offensive play calls. The first came at the end of the second quarter when, facing a fourth-and-one the 49ers lined up to attempt the conversion. With the play-clock hitting zero it appeared that J.T. O’Sullivan would be called for a delay of game however the officials ruled that a timeout had been called beforehand.

    In typical Mike Nolan fashion, playing not to lose instead of to win, the field goal unit came out and Joe Nedney converted the kick for three points. The second occurrence took place with the team facing a third-and-seven towards the end of the game. DeShaun Foster ran up the middle for six, the drive ended with another Nedney field goal.

    The latter play is the more glaring of the two in that on a third down play like this Martz would have undoubtedly called a pass play, which he most likely did only to be overruled by Nolan. This might have something to do with the fact that Martz who almost always makes himself available for post-game questions disappeared from the locker room without speaking to anyone.

    If in fact Nolan did pull rank on Martz and disallow him to make the calls in either of those situations that alone (at least in my mind) is reason enough to out an end to his tenure in the city by the bay. Martz is a renowned offensive mind and should be given full autonomy to call the plays as he see’s fit.”

  • Adam49

    1st, i really dont care if I rub people the wrong way.I come on this site to voice my opinions,and listen to what other 9er fans have to say,not worry about who I might offend.And i’m not sure what you mean by misunderstandings and short sightedness.Not even sure if that’s a word,but anyhow.I am not looking past Nolan’s mistakes but you didn’t say anything I haven’t read 1000 times before.You said nothing new in this article.And I personally like how you say if Nolan had any kind of heart or cared anything about this team he would step aside.You think Nolan would have wanted to keep his job if he didn’t care about his team.He honestly thinks this team is on the brink of greatness and I believe that also.You say McCloughen had a big hand in bringing players in through free agency and the draft.Well if Nolan is as power hungry as you mention then no I don’t.And before this year McCloughen was not Genral Manager he was Director of Player Personnel.So mMAYBE besides this last draft and free agency,no I dont believe McCloughen had a large roll in that department.And finally let me correct you on 1 of your mistakes.article.You say some speculate that in typical Nolan fashion he pulled rank on Martz in 2 plays.Where do you get your info from?1st Nolan can pull rank on Martz whener he damn well pleases,that’s why he is HEAD COACH.2nd,you or whoever your quoting is flat out wrong on the second call.This is a quote from Mike Martz on 49erswebzone.com.

    Martz called the third-down draw play to DeShaun Foster deep in Cardinals territory “an unsual call.” “That was kind of a guess for me. I really felt like they were going to be in coverage. … We just missed a block on a safety otherwise (Foster) was taking it in. he certainly would have had the first down. If that makes it, then it’s not an issue.”
    So your whole paragraph insulting Nolan and saying Martz would have undoubtedly called a pass,WRONG.And then also sayin that was the reason Martz wasn’t available for an interview are outrageous.Maybe a little research before you post next time.James,this is not even close to your best work man.In fact it is very elementary.Please don’t try and make this article sound sophisticated by saying I don’t comprehend it.

  • Adam49

    Gomez,your quote about not have to take a QB early is right on.Tom Brady was a 6th round pick for crying out loud.But when your glaring need is a QB,and the #1 rated player in the draft is a QB,then I think you are in between a rock and a hard place.Nolan and Co. have drafted pretty well over the years.But the QB position is the downfall.I think it is time to move on and talk about the future of this team.

  • Adam49

    And as you guys can see,that was not a good year for QB’s.

  • AM

    and alex smith is a bust. plane and simple. watch him play closely. he is too indecisive and has no accuracy. he misses wide open throws. he was the wrong pick. we should have still had garcia. that was the wrong move.

  • joe gomez

    AM.. its only an idiot play if it doesnt work. Ive seen plenty of times when draw plays suprises the defense and it goes for a first down or even a TD.

    Reviewing some games on NFL Network, I checked out the Rams and Seahawks and came up with this:

    1) Rams defense isnt very good.
    2) Deshean Jackson shouldve been a Niner. (McNabb threw to him on the very first play of the game and Deshean attacked the ball in tight coverage for a 40-yard play. He finished with over 100 yards and also had a 60 yd punt return.
    3) Rams dont have a very good receiving corps anymore. They got some guy named Looker that gets alot of passes thrown his way.
    4) Mike Holmgren will retire at the end of the season. Maybe we could “unretire” him if Nolan gets fired.
    5) Trent Edwards is pretty good. Didnt he play for Stanford?
    6) Marshaun Lynch is a beast.
    7) Seahawks O-Line is pretty pathetic
    8) Roscoe Parish is the next Dante Hall (amazing cutbacks!)
    9) Nate Burleson is pretty good. (Too bad he wont be on the field Sunday)
    10) That fake field goal by Buffalo was a masterpiece. I hope Martz has a few tricks for us as well
    11) Seneca Wallace lining up at WR? They must be desperate.
    12) Julius Jones is an average RB. One Patrick Willis hit and hell be below average.

    Go Niners!

  • joe gomez

    For those who thought JTO’s interception was his fault:

    “Martz said Battle broke the route off too early.”

  • joe gomez

    If JTO falters, should we take a shot at this guy? I heard he had decent skills at QB…

    Profootballtalk.com is reporting that the relationship between Jeff Garcia and Jon Gruden is severely damaged and both of them are “ready to kill each other”. It was also stated that the Bucs are willing to take just about anything to get rid of Garcia, possibly even cutting him from the team if there are no offers.

  • Rob

    Well, I have to give Nolan credit this year. He is making changes that are long overdue. First, Alex Smith. Now, Banta-Cain. Check it out.

    http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/

  • Samra

    actually shane smith would be in tampa and the bucs would be the luckiest mf’s

  • http://49ersscout stokes83

    you said everything i’ve been saying about Alex and Nolan.

    No way, no how, Nolan.

  • Adam49

    I think if we fire Nolan at the end of the year we should promote Martz to head coach.Our defense is already set,and Grg Manusky and Scott McCloughen can keep the talent level high on our defense.With Martz building our offense.And Gomez 2 things.That fake field goal was amazing.My buddy and I just happened to be watching that game when it happened.I was stunned.Not 1 player on their special teams unit noticed him standing by the sideline all by himself.lol.And Roscoe Parrish has speed like i’ve never seen before.He can get to top speed in 3 steps.And just to throw this in,the whole Rams team isn’t very good.When I was watching parts of the Rams game,nobody on that team had any excitement or any desire to play the game.They will be lucky to win 3 games this year.

  • AXEGRINDER

    James, good article. I agree with almost everything you said, with the exception of Mike Martz being the head coach. If Nolan were to be fired during the season, Martz being the interim HC would be acceptable, but he is not the long term answer. Martz is more hard-headed than even Nolan. Plus his track record for gameday management isn’t that good. Knowing when to call a timeout and all that shit isn’t exactly his forte. A head coaches lack of understanding or downright stubborness when it comes to basic fundamentals of managing a game really pisses me off. (Although I do think the Niners would win more games with Martz in there, but he would have us fans scratching our heads sometimes also)

    The bottom line is Nolan isn’t aggressive enough on offense or defense. He’s the ultimate micro-manager, and he’s wrong way too much. I’ll freely admit I was on Nolan’s bandwagon before last season, but now I can’t stand to look at the prick, much less listen to his bullshit explanations for his stupid decisions on KNBR. I’m for Holmgren coming in here and cleaning house in that front office while we still have the talent on the field to win some goddamn games.

    And what Alex Smith coulda been or shoulda been is irrelevent now. That bridge has been burned down. Just another screwup on a long list of screwups.

  • AXEGRINDER

    And the Seahawks getting faked out on a field goal shouldn’t be that surprising. Remember ’06 when Smith on playfake made the entire stadium look retarded when he walked into the enzone from the 15 yard line. That shit was awesome. One of the few fond memories of this regime.

  • Adam49

    Release his sorry ass if he wants to be released.It's not like he did crap for us last year anyway.Except for miss a shit load of tackles.

  • joe gomez

    Maybe we should see how he does in a couple of games. Ive heard hes had a decent preseason and i guess hes claiming he was hurt last season since hes saying hes 100% this year.

  • http://49ersnews.com James

    I really wish I could keep up with Adam's level of mental aptitude. I feel at a loss when involved in coversation with him. I guess I better stop now before I am bested once more.

    Joe: I highly doubt that the team brings back Garcia. They are set on JT being the man and have Martin now as the third option.

    As an aside, initially I was against the Martin signing. I had thought that bringing in someone younger with some potential for the future was the best idea. However in looking at this a little deeper the signing makes sense.

    Martin is not going to create any rifts in the team, he is not going to be called on this season (hopefully) to do anything but suit up and stand on the sidelines with Shaun Hill. A younger QB would be waiting in the wings and if JT struggled as the season wore on there would be nothing but people calling for the new quarterback to start. That is not something this team needs and at this point getting behind O'Sullivan and hoping for the best is the right thing to do.

    Axe: I don't know, I think that perhaps Martz as learned to be a better coach overall the past few years and now that he has another elite back to help make his offense go he might fare differently. Also I agree either way that the team would be better off with him at the helm instead of Nolan.

    Souza: That's the issue isn't it? It was speculated by Maiocco before the season began that if the team failed again Nolan would be to blame and he and Martz would most likely both be gone. However if the team is successful then Martz would garner the credit for installing his offense and turning things around. I believe that Nolan is truly in a

    no win situation at this point and no matter the outcome of the season will be let go.

    TBC needed to produce last season and this preseason to gain any ground with the coaching staff. As it is his spin move is the only thing he has and that doesn't work anyway. At this point if he isn't playing and isn't happy about it (understandable) then trade him for a late round draft pick.

  • joe gomez

    So Martin is number 3? When I read he was coming in to take Alex's spot it sounded like he was coming in to be number 2. Shit, if hes coming in for hthe 3rd spot, why are people making such a big deal about him? Niner pundit sounded as if hes incapable. He knows this system and he has decent numbers. I remember watching him with the rams, there was no real drop off from when Bulger got hurt. Hes got a quick release and is very accurate. His age doesnt bother me, thats not real old in terms of the QB position. Either way, Hill or Martin will be suitable to be 2nd string. People will calling for Rattay but I think Martin was a good choice. No problems with it, im sure the coaching staff had QB's try out and saw what he could do. As far as Garcia, he might be released either this or next season. Just in case JTO doesnt work out, only then we can possibly look at Garcia. I think JTO is going to do some good things this year though. I like his style. The INT was Battle's fault so he just needs to have more awareness in the pocket and secure the ball better. That can be fixed. Other than that, he looks like a real bonafide leader.

  • joe gomez

    James what did you think of Kyle Wright? I guess he was supposed to be pretty good. I wonder if he got picked up.

  • http://49ersnews.com James

    Joe: As of now Martin is listed as the third team quarterback behind JTO and Hill. I think the reason that people were somewhat up in arms over the signing was what I had mentioned in my previous post and what I felt originally as well. If Smith’s days are numbered in San Francisco then why not go out and sign a young QB like Simms for example to at least try and salvage the position for the future. As I said this team is now staked to O’Sullivan like it or not, bringing in a younger QB would have only caused problems within the ranks. Martin is no threat to start barring injury so JT will not be looking over his shoulder which would make his task that much more difficult then it already is for him.

    I would have to say that the team is not interested in Garcia in any scenario, this season or any after that… that ship has sailed. Just my opinion.

    As of now it appears that Wright has not been picked up by any team. NFL.com still has him listed as being a 49er.

  • Adam49

    Wow.James you say you feel your at a loss when involved in a conversation with me?Why because I proved your idiotic theory about the 2nd bad play call on Nolan was flat out wrong?Please don't try and make yourself look intelligent by putting me down.Prove me wrong like I proved you wrong.It works alot better.Because we differ on opinions doesn't make you more intelligent.Also,you argue with me about how stupid the signing of Martin was.I tell you it's for depth and its a short term fix because he has knowledge of Martz offense.Now you agree?So you may feel at a loss when you talk to me,but i've proved you wrong twice now.I acknowledged to Gomez that I may have been wrong about Alex Smith.Maybe you should man up and admit you where wrong on both those points.Either way i'm not gonna try and say you are not an intelligent man.You are,but because we disagree,you shouldnt put my intelligence into question.Lets move on.

  • joe gomez

    This survey is floating around so I decided to answer it..who would you all pick for the greatest ever in 49ers history?

    1) Bob St. Clair

    2) Ronnie Lott

    3) Joe Montana

    4) Jerry Rice

    5) Steve Young

    My pick for the greatest 49er ever has to go to Joe Cool.

  • http://49ersnews.com James

    Once again sarcasm detection is not your strong suit Adam… it's alright.

    And as for the Martin signing, like I said at first I was against it and have since come to see it in a new light. This had nothing to do with you or any argument we had about the subject. It had to do with the explanation I gave, and you keep saying Martin was signed for "depth" no kidding, any QB signed would have been for that purpose being that the team was down to Robinson as the emergency quarterback. How you proved me wrong in regards to Martin is beyond me being that it's a matter of opinion as to whether or not it was a good signing, my change in such, again has nothing to do with you.

    You proved nothing wrong, as far as I'm concerned that entire second play call and who made it in the end is open to interpretation. And as a matter of fact you did nothing other then pull Martz's comments off of the Bee or the Press Dem AFTER I had already posted this and before those were made available on Webzone (why am I not surprised you frequent that site?). So kudos to you for "proving my theory wrong" there Adam.

    Once again putting words in my mouth, I never said I was more intelligent then you. I don't even know you sir and to do so would be irresponsible given the circumstances.

    Yes, let's move on.

    Joe: I would have to go with Joe no doubt, although Jerry is a close second.

  • Adam49

    It's not a coincedence that both Steve Young and Joe Montana are in the Hall of Fame.They threw to the greatest reciever to ever set foot on a field.And really there's nobody even close to Jerry Rice.He is the greatest in the history of the NFL,not just the niners.

  • http://49ersnews.com James

    They both also threw the ball to John Taylor, Brent Jones, and numerous other players as well.

    And to be honest Adam, Joe has the Hall locked before Jerry was drafted. Winning two Super Bowls as well the MVP of both games were enough to get him in even if Rice had never come to the team and they had never won another title.

    Not discounting Jerry's ability or contributions to the team and the league but Joe was the best quarterback to ever play the game. If Rice and the Niners had say Mirer and Dilfer passing to them instead of Joe and Steve, they never even smells a ring.

  • joe gomez

    Also, when Joe was traded to another team at his advance age, he took the Chiefs deep into the playoffs and still had unbelievable comebacks. When Jerry went to other teams at his advanced age his numbers kept decreasing and decreasing. That is why the QB position is the most important of any other position. Without Joe, I dont think Jerry has his records or rings. Without Jerry, I think Joe still has the stats, records, and rings. Either way however, they are both great and having them on our team was phenomenal. That is why we have been spoiled in the bay area but now are suffering. Hopefully, one day ill be around to attend another parade down Market street.

  • Adam49

    Well james I cant fault Jerry Rice for not being born earlier but what I can say is that Dilfer threw the ball to somebody and got himself a nice one.And Gomez although joe did take his team deep intp the playoffs,his stats were down as well.Probably because he didn't have Rice to throw to.And Jerry Rice went to the Raiders and went to a SB and a NFC championship game.I'm pretty sure we could do this all day because to say the least,they were the best players in NFL history at their positions in my opinion.

  • Adam49

    Ita a team sport regardless.And Joe was the bomb no doubt.But compare Joe's stats to other QB's,then compare Jerry's stats to other WR's.That was really my point.You'll get much more people to argue with you about Joe being the best QB in NFL history than you will with Jerry being the best WR in NFL history.There's really nobody to compare Jerry with.People can argue that Dan Marino,Brett Favre,Tom Brady,Steve Young,or John Elway among others were better than Montana.But I am not one of those people.

  • joe gomez

    You got serveral good points adam, but the only reason I have Montana slightly over Jerry is the importance of the position. Adam, how do you see this game against the hawks?

    Some dipshit NFL analyst has us losing 40 to 10 or some retarded outcome like that. I think JTO will have a monster day against that secondary.

  • joe gomez

    Ok I found out who the idiot writer is..Peter King. I was wrong about the score he predicted. He actually said Seahawks 40, 49ers 17 but its still a blowout. What a dumb fuck.

    http://www.fannation.com/peter_king_challenge/pet

  • joe gomez

    The bitch writes for SI.com. Hes gonna shit his pants when he finds out we won.

  • Adam49

    Jerry Rice

  • Adam49

    And James, 49erswebzone is a great site in my opinion.

  • joe gomez

    Adam, yeah he is the greatest. It was the greatest passing to the greatest, but being that the QB position in my opinion a more important position, I had to go with #16. They both are the greatest ever.

  • Adam49

    And gomez Rice got 1 of his Rings with Steve Young,so he would have at least 1 if Joe wasn’t around.

  • http://49ersnews.com James

    Joe: Great points. I too hope to see a few more parades down Market in my time. This team was blessed to only have the greatest WR of all time but HOF starting quarterbacks from 1981 to 1999… actually blessed is an understatement.

    Adam: I never said Rice should be faulted for anything, let alone being born when he was. Dilfers ring is a product of the Ravens defense, without the team never wins the title.

    Joe played in only 11 games in 1993 his first season in KC. He passed for 2144 yards in those 11 games and had 13 touchdowns to seven interceptions. He did that was a washed up Marcus Allen carrying the ball and with Willie Davis and JJ Birden as his starting receivers, they had 52 and 51 catches respectively. He also took that team to the AFC Championship game.

    Not bad for being 37 years old and lacking a true #1 receiver.

  • Adam49

    40-10?WOW.Find out if he wants to wager on that score.What an idiot.It’s not hard to jump on the 49ers suck bandwagon,but stay the fuck off the niners are goin to the playoffs bandwagon after we start hitting our groove.We are gonna stomp these bitches sunday.Make sure you keep his website close,so you can write him a nice response after we whoop that ass.

  • Adam49

    I can’t believe he wrote that crap.He is usually better than that.After the game we will rub it in a bit.

  • http://49ersnews.com James

    It could be worse Joe and Adam, King could have been Colin Cowherd who picked Seattle to win becasuse, and I quote;

    “I’m not sold on Alex Smith. Smith continues to have problems in San Francisco. Seattle and the points untill the young Smith proves himself.”

    I hate ESPN for reasons like this.

  • Samra

    james seriously these people get paid thousands to do this and some mothafuckas till think that alex smith or starting or that the seahawks will win

  • Los Banos Jerry

    Joe Montana was #1.

    James I disagree with your article. I would of responded
    sooner but I lost my father this week. Your 1st one was
    JTO trying to get them to jump off sides. For a 1st down.
    When they couldn’t they called a time out. They planned
    on kicking a field goal.

    on the your second one. 3rd and 7. The draw play to Faulk
    was very prevelant with the Rams and Faulk. Use to burn
    the 9ers regularly.

    Its a shame that your hatred for Nolan has clouded your
    perspective.

  • Medford

    Hey James just wanted to say that I enjoy ur comments and agree with you almost everytime. I thought Colin Cowherd was a Niner fan I guess he aint anymore if he doesnt even know about alex smith. Thats crazy Hey Colin theres a thing called the internet DONKEY.

  • 9nerfan

    we niners fans have been spoiled for having two of the greatest quarterbacks of all time throwing to the goat in jerry. we were so use to success and being the envy of the rest of the league for 2 decades. it just fuckin sucks we been on the bottom end of the league for sometime now. every damn year i have high hopes for ths team, EXEPT, dennis ericksons dumb ass year. i know im damn sure ready to start talking crap to my friends about how my niners kicked the shit out of their team who ever it is. i want that time to be NOW. and for the greatest niner ever, i seriously cant answer that question. its between joe and jerry.

  • 9nerfan

    you guys remember 94. steve rolling off the field in detroit. next thing you know KABOOM. one of the greatest offensive explosion in nfl history. god that was great. hopefully we see that kind of production again. not to mention our defense was bomb too. just watching it on youtube

  • AXEGRINDER

    Hey Joe, don’t listen to these ESPN self-proclaimed experts. They are all complete morons. We as fans know more about what’s going on in the NFL and with our team than these asswipes do. What’s even worse is that these dipshits get paid to spew hot garbage out their mouths every week. ESPN as a whole are the biggest bandwagon jumpers in existence. It’s not hard to say that the team who won last week is going to win this week. No insight whatsoever. SI is the same. Peter King is a jerkoff. I’ll bet he didn’t even realize the Seahawks have no wideouts before he wrote that horseshit. I guess I’m just so sick and tired of all the negative press surrounding the 49ers for so long that I’m ready to kick someone’s ass.

  • Medford

    We need to end the negative press by winning some freakin games thats the only way people will take notice of us once and for all. I HOPE WE BEAT THE SEACOCKS GO NINERS AND GO DUCKS!!!!

  • joe gomez

    Jerry.. my deepest condolences. I know how its like to lose a parent.. god bless his soul.

    Welcome back, we are going to crush those Seahawks, we have too many doubters, we HAVE to win this game!

  • Niner Pundit

    joe…your posts are still there. I didn't erase anything. I have no problems with the I Told You So's. Thing is you usually wait until more than 1 game to throw them out.

  • joe gomez

    Adam, good pointing that out that were moving up the charts on both D and O. I also heard that about our secondary. They said the Rookie Seahawk receivers were going to go against the most experienced secondary in the NFL. As far as Roman though, if Goldson is a better player than him the coaches should recognize that and play him instead regardless of experience.

  • James

    Jerry, first and foremost I am deeply sorry to hear about your loss. I cannot imagine losing a parent man. My prayers are with you and your family.

    Ok, it has nothing to do with any hatred for Nolan… it has to do with those two plays and typically how they might have been called by Martz in the past. On the first play it was 4th and 1, Arizona had already gone for it on 4th down twice by then I think. Point blank, they should have gone for it there regardless of getting the line to jump or not.

    Just because I am no longer a Nolan backer does not cloud my judgement… you really need to go back and read the article Jerry, it was all speculation as to what might have happened during those two sequences, never one did I say that any of it happened for certain. None of us know for sure what took place on those two plays between the two coaches.

  • Adam49

    What would make you think anything went on during those 2 plays.What evidence do you have to even bring the subject up.Martz is calling the plays.Plain and simple.As Jerry said above,Martz ran that draw play many times before with Faulk,so why wouldn’t he run it with Gore.

  • James

    Thought we were going to move on there Adam… I guess not.

    Because it was the same as last season. It appeared to be conservative play calling, which as anyone knows is Nolan’s forte.

    Do some reading in the aftermath of the game and you will see that I am not the only person on the planet who had the same thoughts. You ask the question as if it’s not possible that others had the same initial opinions as I.

    Are you on the sidelines when the plays are being called Adam? Have you spoken to Martz and Nolan about this? Didn’t think so, you are speaking as if you are in the know about this subject, not even thinking there mighht be the slight chance that you really don’t know if Nolan is doing anything on the offensive side of the ball during games.

    Also it was Foster who carried the ball on the draw play, not Frank.

    Really, I was fine letting it go man. We had our little banter back and forth and that was cool but don’t try and piggy back on Jerry while also trying to stir the pot once more. Now, can we really move on from this discussion as was you initial suggestion, or are we going to delve back in?

  • Adam49

    I think I recall the Sleelers punting on 4th and 1.I wonder if Nolan had something to do with that.It’s awfully conservative.What happened to Niner Pundit?His articles where alot more interesting,and professional.And when people disagreed with him he accepted that.You’ve been on this site a couple weeks and you’ve flip flopped more than John Kerry.

  • Adam49

    Here’s some positive news I didn’t know.Our offense is ranked 6th in the league in yards per play(6.61) and our defense is ranked 5th in yards per play(3.96).At least it’s some good news.

  • Adam49

    And I found this to be pretty interesting also:

    Those who wonder why Dashon Goldson can’t seem to displace Mark Roman at safety should read the following statistic. It comes courtesy of 49ers PR staffer Ryan Moore who looked at the opening day starting secondaries – two cornerbacks, two safeties – of all 32 teams. What he found was that Walt Harris, Nate Clements, Michael Lewis and Roman are the most experienced unit in the NFL by a fairly big margin. They have a combined 499 games played. The next team on the list is Denver with 477 games played. The 49ers’s secondary also has a combined 426 starts. Second place in that category goes to Baltimore with 368 games started. It’s indicative of how much stock Mike Nolan – who was very particular when building his secondary — puts in experience. Roman has played in 115 games, starting 86. Goldson has played in 11 games and started zero.

  • joe gomez

    Actually I think Niner Pundit erased my posts when he didnt agree with me about Desean Jackson and Aaron Rodgers. See, those players are who I wanted in the draft and made the comment, “I told you so” without saying it to anyone in particular. I guess he didnt like the comment and told me they only had one good game and that I shouldnt say that. In my personal opinion, they will continue to do well this year with their respective teams but I guess he wanted it off the board.

  • joe gomez

    Niner Pundit, my bad then..thought you did since I couldnt see it anymore. As far as Aaron goes, maybe one game is too soon. In my opinion, Deshaun is so talented, been training hard all his life to get to this position, proving his doubters wrong, the man is just talented and hes for real.

  • Los Banos Jerry

    Joe and James thanks for your support. My father was 82 and
    a real 49er fan. He’ll be missed. Go niners.

  • James

    I have no issues whatsoever with you disagreeing with me Adam, you ask questions in an attempt to stir the pot and I answer you. I can accept when people don’t share my opinions, you on the other hand once again can’t seem to let the topic go even though – again – you were the one who suggested we “move on” so who’s flip flopping now?

    Second, I have been a member of this site for the last four years there my man but nice try.

    Your little quips are hilarious Adam; really I wish that I possessed your comical prowess. I have flip flopped huh? Hmmm I had a change in opinion in regards to one subject but you go ahead and continue over exaggerating in an attempt to make yourself look better you internet warrior you.